Part 1 - Interview with Carol Perryman

Interview on Friday, October 27, 2006 with Carol Perryman (In Second Life, her name is Carolina Keats. Also note, that in Second Life, my name is Vega Larkin.)

Carol Perryman has created a virtual Consumer Health Library in Second Life. On Friday, October 27th, we met in virtual space at her library in Second Life to discuss this project.

[14:59] You: First, I want to thank you for taking the time to meet and discuss your Consumer Health Library
[14:59] You: especially on a Friday night!
[14:59] Carolina Keats: you're welcome - I'm delighted to meet with you!
[15:00] You: Can you tell me a little bit about your background in RL?
[15:00] Carolina Keats: I can actually provide you with a link to my research page which gives you detail, if you'd like
[15:00] You: yes, thanks
[15:00] Carolina Keats: but I am also happy to talk about my career
[15:01] You: Are you curently working in RL as a medical librarian?
[15:01] Carolina Keats: http://www.unc.edu/~cperryma/Research/Research%20page.htm
[15:01] Carolina Keats: no
[15:01] Carolina Keats: currently I am a 3rd year PhD student at UNC-Chapel Hill in North Carolina
[15:01] You: Is your work in 2L for your PhD dissertation?
[15:02] Carolina Keats: I have worked in libraries - public, law, and medical - for 20 years
[15:02] You: That is a broad experience base to bring to this project.
[15:02] Carolina Keats: my work - ? I am a full time researcher, doing my own research (and a number of things)
[15:03] You: (May I take a few snap shots of our conversation?)
[15:03] Carolina Keats: those 20 years were spent as a paraprofessional. I have done nearly everything you can do in a library that's legal, including head of circulation, collection management, copy & original cataloging,
[15:04] Carolina Keats: sure
[15:04] Carolina Keats: education and training... and on and on
[15:05] Carolina Keats: by the time I left the hospital library where I was working (and I worked with Lori), I was classified as a medical reference librarian and the lead consumer health librarian - 2 hats
[15:06] Carolina Keats: so I trained residents and allied health staff, designed training materials - and spent half my time doing consumer health reference at our new consumer health library
[15:06] Carolina Keats: I got my MLS at the U of I - Urbana
[15:08] Carolina Keats: did 3 different studies while there, based on my awareness & observation of consumer information behaviors on a smoking cessation forum - quitnet, with more than 600,000 members
[15:08] Carolina Keats: one of those was published, earning me the LIBRI student paper of the year award
[15:08] You: That is extensive experience and recognition!
[15:09] Carolina Keats: and by that time - I was in love with research, dedicated to it. I applied for doctoral programs
[15:10] Carolina Keats: I was awarded the first (one of 2, actually) IMLS TRLN fellowship and spent 2 years as a research fellow, mentored directly by 3 former MLA presidents - one of whom, Joanne Marshall, is my advisor and current mentor
[15:10] Carolina Keats: I've been extraordinarily fortunate
[15:11] You: It sounds like you've had a wonderful career in RL to date.
[15:11] Carolina Keats: I have been having a blast!
[15:11] You: So now you have made an impressive stamp on the virtual world in 2L....
[15:11] You: how did you first learn about 2L?
[15:12] Carolina Keats: I always remembeer what the head of ILL said, in Kansas City KS - "I can't believe I get paid to do something I love so much!"
[15:12] Carolina Keats: It's Lori's fault, she dragged me into it :)
[15:12] You: Yes, librarianship is a great job!
[15:12] You: Where you involved with other virtual worlds or gaming before becoming involved with this project?
[15:13] Carolina Keats: as I said, I was an active participant in Quitnet.com
[15:14] Carolina Keats: cool
[15:14] You: I'm not familiar with Quitnet.com... is that something similar to your consumer health library project?
[15:15] Carolina Keats: quitnet was the brainchild of nathan cobb, a smoking cessation counselor affiliated with the Boston U School of Public Health
[15:15] Carolina Keats: they were supported by Boston U - he was earning his md...
[15:16] Carolina Keats: it became incredibly successful - more than 600,00 participants
[15:16] Carolina Keats: it is a smoking cessation support forum - asynchronous
[15:16] You: Ah, ok.
[15:16] Carolina Keats: many of its members (and it is free, though there is a premium option)
[15:16] You: Can you tell me more about the consumer health library you've created....
[15:17] Carolina Keats: many of them first began to use the internet at that site
[15:17] Carolina Keats: yes
[15:17] You: what are some of your goals with this space?
[15:17] Carolina Keats: the first thing you need to know is that it is grand funded
[15:17] Carolina Keats: let me show you something
[15:17] You: sure
(Avatars move to the front of the virtual Consumer Health Library)

[15:18] Carolina Keats: when I talk about the library this is where I like to start
[15:18] Carolina Keats: because this is what it's all about
[15:18] Carolina Keats: these posters are a listing of support groups at SL
[15:18] Carolina Keats: so far we have identified about 20
[15:19] Carolina Keats: you'll recognize AA - many of these are the SL versions of RL programs
[15:19] Carolina Keats: it is the intention of the grant - and my work here - to support the information needs of these support groups, and sl residents in general
[15:19] You: yes, there are more support groups in 2L than I would have expected....
[15:20] Carolina Keats: it's amazing!
[15:20] You: have you been in touch with members from these different groups?
[15:20] Carolina Keats: I will be going out to the groups, listening. I do not pretend to know what the needs are, or even if there are needs
[15:20] Carolina Keats: some
[15:20] Carolina Keats: we met with the Dream Travelers groups
[15:21] You: That makes sense. It will be a process of getting to know their needs.
[15:21] Carolina Keats: it's a community of stroke survivors
[15:21] Carolina Keats: yes
[15:21] Carolina Keats: but I am not alone in this
[15:21] You: I notice there are several librarians affiliated with the Second Life Medical Library....
[15:22] You: and that you are a member of that group too....
[15:22] You: how does that work with this Consumer Health Library?
[15:22] Carolina Keats: namro is being incredibly supportive, maxito, lori (of course - she sparked it all off!)
[15:22] Carolina Keats: we are colleagues
[15:22] Carolina Keats: namro is a part of the advisory committee for this project, for the library
[15:22] Carolina Keats: we communicate constantly
[15:23] Carolina Keats: we are both exploring different ways to package information - he is miles ahead of me, technologically
[15:24] You: Is there a cost for this library?
[15:24] Carolina Keats: but there are others - a guy in New Zealand with expertise in education will inform the pedagogical aspect, adult education
[15:24] Carolina Keats: a cost?
[15:24] Carolina Keats: for use, you mean?
[15:24] You: sorry that came out of context...
[15:24] Carolina Keats: oh, I hate it when that happens!
[15:25] You: I'm wondering if there is a monthly, annual or other costs for creating this space?
[15:25] Carolina Keats: the island we are getting (have already) will cost
[15:25] Carolina Keats: and of course, my time
[15:25] You: Are you refering to HealthInfo Island?
[15:26] Carolina Keats: but it's a pretty economical way to try out new ideas and ways of providing service
[15:26] Carolina Keats: yes
[15:26] Carolina Keats: that is paid for by the grant
[15:26] You: When is that island targeted to open?
[15:26] You: Is that the Alliant Library grant?
[15:26] Carolina Keats: Brack, who is doing the terraforming, says January
[15:27] Carolina Keats: Alliance Library System, yes
[15:27] You: sorry. right :)
[15:27] Carolina Keats: the plan for the island is to have the consumer library, the medical library, and a hospital
[15:27] Carolina Keats: we will form a little compound
[15:27] You: very exciting!
[15:28] Carolina Keats: the buildings will be centered around a large gathering space/garden
[15:28] Carolina Keats: we want to offer the space to groups and use it for events - health fairs, displays
[15:28] You: Sounds great.
[15:28] Carolina Keats: part of the garden will be a medicinal herb garden
[15:28] Carolina Keats: touch that aloe plant
[15:29] Aloe Vera gave you Aloe vera.
[15:29] Carolina Keats: or any of these 3
[15:29] Carolina Keats: they are information objects
[15:29] Carolina Keats: I am trying to reconceptualize..
[15:29] Carolina Keats: I don't want 'in your face' technology, but something welcoming and beautiful
[15:30] You: It's a great way to provide information in a more untraditional format...
[15:30] Carolina Keats: it's a major challenge to try to think up new things!
[15:30] You: it is so interesting to see the ways designers and librarians are finding to represent the searching.
[15:30] Carolina Keats: one of the things I'm hoping to do is to encourage collaborative learning - not just hand out info
[15:31] You: for information
[15:31] Carolina Keats: yes
[15:31] Carolina Keats: here it's a little different
[15:31] You: yes, i think the "comfortable" setting makes a difference
[15:31] Carolina Keats: consumer health - we want to offer access to good sites
[15:31] Carolina Keats: and we do, through the laptop - you may want to look at the selected resources
[15:32] Carolina Keats: and through the new JNANA objects, which will be interactive
[15:32] You: Many times consumer health sites have disclaimers.... Do you have a disclaimer anywhere in the library?
[15:32] Carolina Keats: but there is a huge component of face-to-face, of the need for tailored information
[15:32] Carolina Keats: no, but I need to.
[15:33] You: I agree - asynchronous services are only so useful....
[15:33] Carolina Keats: the sites I use, however, all do
[15:33] Carolina Keats: I do not provide ANY information with the claim that it comes directly from myself, as advice
[15:33] You: Have you found that you are providing reference services in a synchronous model i.e. chat or meeting with patrons in 2L?
[15:33] Carolina Keats: I have begun to get requests
[15:34] Carolina Keats: thus far, it's been started in SL, then often is continued via email
[15:34] Carolina Keats: because I do an interview, save the transcript - conduct a search, - send citations, along with an offer for further support[15:35] You: What kinds of questions have you received to date? Reference, directional, research?
[15:35] Carolina Keats: we often will meet again - you know, CHI reference is often an evolving relationship
[15:35] Carolina Keats: more complex questions
[15:35] You: interesting!
[15:35] Carolina Keats: but the gamut, really
[15:36] You: Has there been any comparison yet between the reference being offered at the other libraries in 2L?
[15:36] Carolina Keats: from europe, one patron wanted the latest research on migraine therapy - the patron searches pubmed but at a basic level
[15:36] You: Types of questions.... that kind of thing
[15:36] Carolina Keats: there was a language barrier...
[15:36] Carolina Keats: I conducted a search, then set up a current awareness feed to her email
[15:37] You: very cool.
[15:37] Carolina Keats: there is an interest in getting more advanced training, as well
[15:37] You: is this all on your own time? Or are you also funded in part to offer reference services?
[15:37] Carolina Keats: another patron was looking for a support forum - their daughter has a rare disorder
[15:37] Carolina Keats: I am funded by the grant
[15:38] You: Excellent.
[15:38] Carolina Keats: but only for part of the time I put in :)
[15:38] You: I'm sure!
[15:38] You: This is a really interesting project. Are you also involved in building?
[15:39] Carolina Keats: you asked me whether there was any comparison between ref here and at other SL libraries
[15:39] Carolina Keats: no
[15:39] You: That's for future research, perhaps.
[15:39] Carolina Keats: I build small objects, but it's definitely not my thing
[15:40] Carolina Keats: well,but the disparities between rl general ref and consumer ref are equally wide
[15:40] You: Do you see another challenge created by being in virtual space?
[15:41] You: For example, offering virtual reference services on traditional commercial vr services?
[15:41] Carolina Keats: we are challenged to set aside our accustomed paradigms, to inquire - are they useful in this environment?
[15:42] Carolina Keats: yes, there is a huge barrier in that I cannot ethically use UNC library resources so am restricted to free ones
[15:42] You: interesting. can you tell me aboutsome of these changes?
[15:42] You: yes, i can see how that is frustrating
[15:43] Carolina Keats: do you mean the challenges? or the difference between rl and sl consumer health?[15:44] Carolina Keats: come on back up
[15:44] You: you mentioned we are challenged to set aside our accustomed paradigms, to inquire - are they useful in this environment?
[15:44] You: OK.
(Avatars return to inside the Consumer Health Library)

[15:44] Carolina Keats: yes. one example is the reproduction of objects like boks
[15:45] Carolina Keats: and 'library as place'
[15:45] Carolina Keats: what level of cue should be provided to say 'this is an information place'?
[15:45] You: Right.
[15:46] Carolina Keats: I think about my physical appearance, think about how I should look to inspire trust (too much cleavage?)
[15:46] Carolina Keats: should there be books?
[15:46] Carolina Keats: how many books?
[15:46] Carolina Keats: what about signage?
[15:46] You: Do you think you will eventually market your services?
[15:46] Carolina Keats: what about policies?
[15:47] You: Yes, all of the things that make up a library.
[15:47] Carolina Keats: because I am finding that every single issue we deal with in rl libraries has its counterpart, here
[15:47] Carolina Keats: I even saw a discussion on sl library lighting
[15:47] Carolina Keats: there are some barriers
[15:47] Carolina Keats: we don't have true f2f (face to face) here
[15:48] Carolina Keats: no expressions, no meeting of eyes, little body language that's within our control
[15:48] You: yes, that is a challenge with all vr
[15:49] Carolina Keats: but vega? - those are part of the tools a reference librarian uses to establish trust, and to convey nonverbally, lack of judgment of anything the patron might say
[15:49] Carolina Keats: I am very comfortable in a vr environment, because I am very verbal
[15:50] Carolina Keats: but there are problems -and it's hard to anticipate where you might be misunderstood
[15:50] You: yes, you raise an important point...
[15:50] Carolina Keats: especially if people are from different countries
[15:50] You: especially when dealing with health information and potentially very sensitive topics
[15:50] Carolina Keats: yes
[15:51] You: I've taken a brief look at the library....
[15:51] Carolina Keats: there's this gadget thing that you can wear - it can provide translation via babelfish
[15:51] You: Wow. How great.
[15:51] Carolina Keats: I don't want to use it for consumer or medical reference
[15:51] You: Right. You wouldn't want a mistake with this kind of sensitive information.
[15:52] Carolina Keats: exactly
[15:52] You: I've taken a quick look at some of the tools you have created....
[15:52] You: could we take a little look together?
[15:52] Carolina Keats: of course
[15:53] Carolina Keats: I have to admit that some don't work as they should yet - I'm still learning :)

(continued in next posting)